Archie Redheads interview continued

I worked eight years on the railroad. I had three children when I worked on the railroad. I was a single man when I started working for the railway, but by the time I was married and had four children is when I stopped working for the railway. I came to work for the railway four times before I moved here. Most of the men I worked with are now gone, one of them was Peter Beardy my foreman.

Indian agents they only gave us food, salt pork, beans, flour, tea, and jam. They only gave us a little bit of food, they didn't give us any vouchers or money. Same thing when we got here the Indian agent only gave us a little bit of food for our children, but they gave use vouchers for it no checks.

I don't remember the first time I voted, just recently now I didn't think of it.

It was hard living in York Factory we had to walk all over where went, and we slept all over the place. We used dogs too, to travel.

The things the children use today are taking them in the wrong direction, I think. I think about this a lot and talk about it a lot. I don't look at myself, me, I'm looked after, I'll always be looked after. That's why I speak a lot for my children and my great grandchildren that are being born. You see all the things that the white man brings into our community to lead us the wrong way, drugs, alcohol and everything else. I don't want any more drugs or alcohol coming in here, I want them to stop it but it's going to be hard to stop.

I eat the same food I that ate long time ago I don't eat white man food. My children only eat store bought food, that's how they like it. They were brought up that way when they went to school. The fish that comes from Split Lake tastes awful. When I go to Shamattawa I eat delicious fish, their good fish.

When we fist came to York Landing there was lots of muskrats. There's nothing left Manitoba Hydro has destroyed them all by flooding them. They did the same thing to the beaver. When I first I came here I fished, trapped and hunted. Four years ago the caribou started coming here. They were never here before since we relocated here, maybe four years or more. It was wrong of them to relocate us here. They should have taking us somewhere else, I think.

Long time ago women were hard workers they brought up the children while their men were out traveling. They even ice fished to feed their children. They were hard workers and didn't get sick, not like the women today. The men, they hunted, fished, trapped and hauled wood.

I was here in the winter of 1957. It was year before that I was in York Factory. We worked for the Hudson Bay Company all the time loading and unloading the boats. They used two boats, ten men went on one boat and eight men went on the other boat. It took us six days to go to Shamattawa and back to York Factory hauling freight. We only got paid $25.00 for the trip, it was hard work, we worked all of the time, pulling the boat and that was a big wooden boat. There was a hundred pounds per man inside the boat to pull. I worked a long time for them when I was younger.

I never saw any testing done in York Factory. The only thing I seen over there was the big canons.

Today, I eat the same food that I ate when I was a child. I don't eat no white man food. We ate such things as bonnock and soup.

The Women cooked. Nobody complained of their cooking. They knew how to cook so many different ways. Also, they brought up the children. When they had a child they didn't have a doctor or hospital to go to. (Childbirth) They had their children in a wigwam (tent). Even while we were traveling when a woman had a child, we stopped for two days. They had the child outdoors. There was no medicine to help them. They did everything for themselves.

I enjoyed the food I ate in York Factory compared to where and when I moved here (York Landing).

I don't know of any sickness happening in York Factory. Not like today, here in York Landing, there is so many kind of illness. For instance, people with high blood pressure, I never heard of that kind of illness in York Factory. This is happening because they don't use wild food and only use white man food. That's why this is happening to them and hurting them.

I know of some healing which people call witchcraft but I don't know what they used. I saw the Shaking Tents, some people healed others. They gave the people different things to heal them and they received different things in return for healing them like a gun or a boat or dogs. These people were healers and there was only a few of them. I only remember a few persons that did that, one was Sammy Beardy and the other was Johnny Ponask. That's Jerry Ponask's grandfather. I remember and knew that he was a healer.

An Indian Agent came to York Factory once or twice a year. There was one Indian Agent in Ilford who use to come here (York Landing). He use to give us a piece of paper (vouchers) to buy groceries, not like the way it's done today. He did this monthly.

I first went to work for the railroad in 1959 in Ilford. I spent two years there, then went to work at Pit Siding. From there I went to mile 461, 452 and the last place I worked was a mile 474. That's where I quit. I worked for the railroad for about seven years. I came back to York Landing in 1966. When I came back I worked at building houses. I did everything manually we didn't have vehicles to use. I hauled gravel on my back to the work site and we used boats to haul the gravel to here. We had no machinery to use. We used spades to dig holes.

I also worked as a Constable for thirteen years. I worked at different jobs even though I didn't know how to speak English, yet I still managed to work these jobs.

I hope that the future generations get jobs to survive because they can't make a living off trapping anymore. Also, they have to get education to get jobs.

I think that it was around 1960 that I first got to vote in an election.

Children are getting lazier today and I think it's because of these new things that they watch on television. This is what leads them astray because of all the things they see on T.V. They copy the things the see on T.V. and that's why they're like that. They copy what the see on T.V. like people taking their own lives and people shooting each other. This T.V. spoils their way of life. We didn't see this kind of behavior when we lived in York Factory. The children copy what they see on T.V. and imitate it. When we lived in York Factory, children went to bed early, not like today. The children walk around all night. The parents of today don't send their children to bed early.

They use to use schooners (boats) in York Factory. They use to go to Kaskatamagun, inland as far as the deep waters permitted. When the tide was out that's when they unloaded the schooners. They also use to go to Fort Severn. Also, there was these York Boats they used to haul freight. They use to go to Shamattawa also, towards the end of using these York Boats, I remember them being used to haul freight to Norway House. They paddled and portaged these York Boats to where they were going.

My children were sent out to school (residential schools). I saw them only two months out of a year. I didn't think anything of it. I thought they were being looked after and getting their education. Some of them lost their language (Cree). Just recently, one of my children (Jacob), told us of the abuse he went through when he went to school. Just like Donald Saunders spoke about. Just now, all those stories of abuse in school are coming out.

The Indian Agent came to York Factory once or twice a year. He gave us a piece of paper (voucher) and something was done when we arrived here. We never received cheques or money.

My husband worked as a carpenter when we got here and continued to work as a capenter when we got housing. Also he worked as a councilor.

I don't remember when people were allowed to vote. Just recently, I started getting involved in elections.

I don't like children watching T.V. because they see too many bad things in the programs. They don't want to listen when they're told about good things in life. They rather imitate (follow) what they see on T.V.

I remember some people going to work on the railroad. Lots left from York Factory to work on the railroad. That's why there wasn't that many of us when we relocated to here.

I wish that the children of the future get a good education so they can get good jobs.

Thompson - I think we have a better life in York Landing then we had in York Factory. I couldn't really see anyway people could live any longer in York Factory. That's why they left York Factory. They saw they couldn't have a good life any longer in York Factory. I told Eric when he was chief, that it didn't look right for people to keep going back to York Factory. People had already seen they couldn't make a living in York Factory yet they still went to buy buildings there. That was their own buildings that they bought since the money to build these cabins came from here. George Ponask came and told me this, that it wasn't right for them to buy these cabins because Johnny (Hatley) got money from here to build those cabins. Eric didn't listen to me even though I told him why. *(Thompson is referring to the purchase of Silver Goose Lodge and the cabins on Ten Shilling Creek)

I seen healing being done in York Factory. Like one time, I was fishing at Ten Shilling Creek and I cut my foot with an axe. I cut it pretty badly. I was with late Abel Chapman at the time. He took off my rubber on the foot I had cut. He grabbed some willows from near the creek and spit them on my cut foot and wrapped up my cut foot. That's where the medicine was, from the willows.

A long time ago, past Kaskatamagun, two - mush - se - teh, it was called. A man named Solomon, Eli Hill's father, shot a man. Eli was alive at the time when he was a young boy. The bullet hit the man on the chest and went through. This man showed us this wound, his name was Sinclair. He showed us this when he was drunk in Kaskatamagun when we were young boys. The bullet went through his chest and out his back. A man named Elijah ( who was a small man) carried the man inside his house. This man was shot when coming across an island splashing and Solomon mistook him for a caribou. That's what he said. Elijah said that the man laid there and they mixed some willow juice with water and wiped the wound. One month later, they said he was sitting up. Some people came from Fort Severn to get him, but by the time they arrived at Kaskatamagun, he was walking around already. They used Indian medicine to heal him. The women looked after him, he said they didn't help him. Elijah's wife, Mary, is the one who looked after this man who was shot. They take the bark off the willows and syrup inside of the willows and used this for medicine. They crushed the inside of these willows and used it.

One time, lots of people got sick during the summer. This was when a bunch of people from Shammattawa were there. I got sick too and ended up having T.B. (tuberculosis). I spent three years in the hospital for this. Lots of people got this kind of sickness at that time. A doctor diagnosed us, that was the first time they ever X-rayed anybody at that time.

Marion - That's the only kind of sickness I know that existed at that time, T.B. (tuberculosis). Some women got this sickness and I seen a young girl die of something in the blood because of this sickness.

Thompson - I started working for the railroad in 1954 at mile 497. This was for only a while. Archelaus Beardy was working there at the time. Again I went to work for the railroad in 1959 an got on full time. I resigned from the railroad when I was at Pit Siding in 1973. I worked for 19 years for the railroad.

The Indian Agent came to York Factory once or twice a year. His name was Jack Kelly. He was the one who relocated us here. Frank Hughes was involved and Bob Burns the Game Guardian and Joe Robinson. Those are the ones who worked on our relocation to here.

We were given a piece of paper (voucher) from the Indian Agent. We started building houses when we arrived here. There was bush all over this place, where we are today. We had to brush clear first then build the houses where we are today. I worked there all the time. Only Charles Spence from Ilford received payment yet he couldn't even lift one piece of log or lumber to bring up.

I was also a Councilor for thirteen years altogether.

I don't mind watching T.V., but I don't like paying lots of money to do it. My last Hydro bill was $458.00 for one month. Did you hear what Jimmy D. Spence (Nelson House) said when he was here. He told us a story when Hydro first came on the reserve and told them that they would only have to pay $3.60 per month for their Hydro. He said he saw that letter that said that but they can't find that letter now, they lost it. He said that they've been working there for 35 years. This is how Hydro lied to our people.

I can't remember the first time I voted in white man elections.

All our children were sent out to go to school (Residential Schools)

Marion - I felt lonesome for my children, when they first left me to go to school. They lost their Cree language. Just recently, my son, Leonard told us of the abuse they went through when they went to school. That's the only one of our children that told us this, none of our other children talk about it. My younger brother, Frank, also told me of the abuse while in school.

Thompson - Charlie Joe Hart, a councilor from Nelson House, told us about when he went to school (Residential). He said they were only taught half a day and the other half of the day they had to work on the farm shoveling cow shit. They abused us in many ways, he says.

Marion - I hope for a good future for our children and grand and great children. I hope they receive good education as the can get good jobs to live off.

Thompson - That's the only way anybody can survive today is to have education. It's going to be harder in the future, they say. It's happened and is happening today of things they said would happen in the future. We already see this.

(Slated nuclear testing during 1950s)

I never heard of anything going on of testing in York Factory when I lived there. We were told that there was explosives buried at the shore of where the fort is. We were told not to dig around there. That was along time ago. That's what I heard.

Thompson - Life is different today, compared to long time ago. Long time ago, we survived and had a good life because of our hunting trapping and fishing. We had everything we needed to help, like boats and motors. Things weren't expensive then. Not like today, everything is so expensive. Like at that store today, a pound of lard is $1.35.

The late Joseph Saunders told us, when they came up river, he was with his brother-in-law, David Spence. They came to Gillam. Joseph said he bought a tent, one of those big canvas tents, it only cost him $5.50. That's how they made their living, by trapping only. Things weren't expensive at that time. There was no jobs available in York Factory. Only when we went to get wood and floated them in, that's the only time we received payment for our work.

York boats were used to haul freight. One thousand pounds was given to each man on the York Boat to haul. This totaled ten thousand pounds per boat. A smaller boat was made that only carried eight men. They carried eighty thousand pounds. They freighted to Shamattawa.

I can't remember when they freighted to Norway House. My father did tell me that he went to Norway House twice in one summer. He did this by paddling only and pulling their boats along the shore. One time when they were returning from Norway House, one man named Norman Beardy was so competitive, just like the Shammattawa people are, They're always competing against each other. My father was with Moses Beardy and my father cousin Richard Beardy and Josie Beardy and William Grey. There was five of them in one big canvas boat. They didn't tell us how many nights they slept coming back. William Grey told the story, when they were coming back from Norway House, this man, David Beardy, wanted to keep ahead of everybody else. When we paddled past him, David Beardy was paddling so hard to keep ahead of us, that he broke his paddle. When we were approaching this point, we told him to cut across by foot and cut a tree down to make a paddle. By the time we came around this point, he was in the water with a log he had cut down and jumped into the boat. He shaped the paddle while he was in the boat while the other men were paddling. But old William Grey told us that they still left him behind by a good one or two nights.

When we left York Factory, Archie Redhead pulled us with our boat. Late Stanley Saunders had two motors, one, nine horsepower and the other eight horsepower. We used one of them. There was two boats we used. We used my fathers boat. We only had one child at that time.

Marion - She was four months old. That was Marie.

It was hard coming upriver. One place, we had to walk and carry our boat. I carried one boat, following old George. We carried our boats under hanging ice while the others walked on top of the ridges. The other boats with the motors traveled way out in the middle of the river. That was the hardest part of our journey. We arrived at 352 while others arrived at 374.

One time, a white man asked me when we went flying around in York Factory to look at the land by helicopter, where we traveled when we left York Factory. I told him that we came around Marsh Point and went up the Nelson river. We were only given some gasoline I told him. He said that was written in the book he had. Only one couple were flown out of York Factory. That was Moses and Madeline Wastesicoot. They dropped them off here. Another couple, Jim John and Celiah, were dropped off at Ilford, but they went to Churchill by train. I told that white man what I though of my relocation and the hard journey I had to do to get to York Landing. I don't have any regrets about my hard journey, getting to the railroad tracks. Look at today, I told him, I've been sitting in this helicopter for three days flying around.

We took over one week to get to the railroad track at 352.

Marion - We also stayed at Gillam and also stopped at Ilford.

Thompson - We stopped and stayed overnight at any spot we could find to be comfortable when we relocated. We used the train to get to Gillam from mile 352. We stayed in Gillam one week. We stayed in Ilford and our families stayed there while we came to work here with men from Ilford. We came to work on the logs. Boy, Horace Saunders didn't like it when we got here. He didn't like it. He couldn't even catch a rabbit when he set up snares. That's how much he didn't like coming here.

Marion - They used to catch huge jack fish down by the shore here where the high hill (Location Unknown) used to be.

Thompson - We used to catch big jack fish in our nets there. Now, today, there is no more of that kind of fish.

Marion - The taste of fish today is bad compared to the ones in York Factory. Also the geese that are killed here compared to the ones we used to eat in York Factory. I don't know why it's like this.

Thompson - We asked about the geese one time, why they would fly through when they get to York Factory. Not like long ago, when they use to stay there 'til late fall. They told us that they fly through because there was no more food for them there. It's true what they say, because all you can see over there is mud flats. Also, the food they eat along the way like from the farmer's fields. Lots of these geese become skinny. We noticed this when we killed them over there.

(*MISS - SEE - KE - TICK (dirty knees)) How about our late grandfather, MISS - SEE - KE - TICK, who had ten wives. Late Richard Beardy told this story of his late grandfather. He pounded like he watched him all the time. Lots of women were inside. This one woman was moaning in pain. She was ready to have a child. Just like he didn't notice, he just, sat there. The new born child cried out. I guess old MISS - SEE - KE - TICK just looked up and said, "MAW".

That's one of MISS - SEE - KE - TICK's sons, the son named David Beardy. Also, where the picture of Charles Wastesicoot was taken, the two men shown in that picture on each side are MISS - SEE - KE - TICK's sons. Robert Beardy is standing on the right side of Charles Wastesicoot and Sandy Beardy is on the left side.

We mostly eat wild food, we seldom eat white man food. All my grandchildren come and eat here at dinnertime. They eat what we eat. Like this afternoon, I ate sturgeon.

Marion - I cooked up caribou meat for them. That's what they all ate.